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Michael Leavitt & Co Inspections, Inc.

MONDAY MORNING MESSENGER

Message prepared especially for Members of the American Institute of Inspectors® as well as Home Inspectors abroad

December 3, 2001

GOOOOOD MORNING, A.I.I.™....

It's a great day here in Orem, Utah! I like to start off the MMM this way because it sets the mood. The reality is that as you are reading this I will be braving the elements to drive to the SW corner of Wyoming to do an inspection. The weather couldn't be any more difficult for the trip as we are getting hit by the foul weather that was in California and Oregon just a day or two ago.

I would love to hear from you snowbound inspectors as to the special clothing, equipment, or procedures that you go through to get your jobs done. One thing is for sure and that is my current inspection vehicle is not the best for winter travel. 9 months out of the year the mini-van is a great option, but there are 3 months of snow that make mountain treks more difficult. What are the vehicles of choice for snow inspections?

How many pairs of footwear do you take to rain and snow inspections? How do you keep your ladders dry and keep from tracking in mud, rain and snow? Have any of you had to cancel an inspection, or series of inspections as a result of whether? How did your clients take the bad news? Did it make your client miss their inspection deadline?

And finally, what is the medication of choice to get you through a day when the flue or cold has hit you hard? Have you ever called in sick? This job really isn't conducive to bailing out on an appointment. I heard about an inspector who showed up and the family was sick so he wore his respirator throughout the interior portion of his inspection. I find that it is hard to get through a winter season without catching several bugs. Just think of all the different germs that we get exposed too that other people never encounter. Every inspection brings long term exposure to the breeding grounds of all kinds of thriving germs........ How do all of you avoid getting sick?

AII™ BOARD MEETING MINUTES

American Institute of Inspectors

Board of Directors Minutes

November 1, 2001

Peppermill Resort Casino, Reno, Nevada

Board Members Present: Bill Schwahn, Ron Cloyd, Rick DeBoard, Greg

Justice, Gary Holzbauer, John Rebenstorff, Earle Alford, Jim Corbin,

Guests Present: Scott Merritt, , Brent Foster, Michael Leavitt, Jim Archer, Steve Bradley, Nathan Buckley, Misty Buckley, Betty Buckley,

Call To Order: Call to order was given at 7:15 PM by Chairman Ron Cloyd.

Old business:

1. As the Board was one member short of having a quorum for this meeting, Chairman Ron Cloyd appointed John Rebenstorff as Director at Large for the remainder of this year. This was necessary because Bill Ball has resigned and Steve Jordan has retired.

2. Betty Buckley read the minutes of the last meeting and the Board voted unanimously to accept the minutes as read.

3. Jim Corbin reported on the progress of the Standards of Practice updates. A discussion followed which resulted in the following:

Bill Schwahn will appoint a committee to come to conclusions regarding the updates by the end of January, 2002, and then it will be taken to the membership for a vote over the internet.

4. Betty Buckley reported on the progress of the obtaining of Liability Insurance for the Board members. She is having trouble getting the insurance company to return her phone calls, so she will send them a letter.

A discussion followed regarding Service Agreement updates, and Michael Leavitt will head a committee to accomplish this tack. The results will be coming by the next conference.

5 Financial report was presented by Betty Buckley a copy of which will be placed in the Corporate Minute Book. She is not asking the Board the approve next years budget at this time, until she receives some input from the Education Committee on their proposed needs for conference classes.

6 Nathan Buckley, Technical Director, reported on the Hot line and website. The hosting company is having trouble with the zip code search feature. Bill Schwahn suggested that we pay for someone to work out this detail so that the site can be fully functional.

Michael Leavitt will transfer the MMM to the A.I.I. website soon.

7. Scott Merritt reported on the progress of the Education Committee. He will take suggestions by email and have an outline ready by next conference. Bill Schwahn will appoint a chairman for a new committee to take over the membership portion of the Education committee.

8. Ron Cloyd reported that the materials which Bill Ball has requested A.I.I. stop using of his during the last Board Meeting have not been received as of yet. Bill was to send in highlighted copies of any material he felt was being used without his permission.999

President’s report by Bill Schwahn:

1. Results were given of the 2002 General Election. These results will be inserted into the Corporate Minute Book.

· President Elect – John Rebenstorff

· Vice-President – Peter Barten

· Secretary – Nathan Buckley

· Treasurer - Gary Holzbauer

· Directors at Large – Don Pearman and Greg Pyfrom, Sr.

· Member Directors – Steve Bradley and Bill Schwahn

2. Ethics Committee- A protocol was constructed by Greg Justice which is now in place for dealing with complaints to A.I.I. concerning activities of the membership. This protocol will be placed on the MMM so that it will be common knowledge among the members.

3. Review of Standing Committees. A copy of the Standing Committees Handout from Bill Schwahn will be put into the Corporate Minute Book.

· Ethics Committee – Greg Justice and Peter Barten

· Standards Committee – Jim Corbin

· Education Committee – Scott Merritt, John Rebenstorff, Jon Gudnason and Brent Foster

· Membership Committee -

New Business:

1. The Board voted in Bill Schwahn as a new certified instructor.

2. Earle Alford brought to the Board some suggestions for seminars and “The Home Inspector” image. The major part of his proposal was to establish some type of help for members to attend seminars who do not have the funds to do so. It was decided that this idea will be given to the Membership committee.

3. John Rebenstorff motioned, Earle Alford seconded, and it was unanimously approved that the new North Oregon Chapter of A.I.I. be recognized as a legitimate Chapter of the Association.

4. Ron Cloyd requested to have the policy reviewed which restricts putting on Certification classes 60 days prior to conferences. Bill Schwahn motioned and Gary Holzbauer seconded that this issue be given to the Education committee for review. The motion carried unanimously.

5. Betty Buckley requested that compensation be provided to Misty Buckley of $100 per month for her duties of Administrative Assistant. It was so motioned by John Rebenstorff and seconded by Earle Alford. It was carried unanimously by the Board.

6. Ron Cloyd headed a discussion of some way to help Board Members at Large (those board members who are not inspectors) to get to the Board meetings. It was motioned by Bill Schwahn and seconded by Earle Alford that the Association pick up the reasonable expenses for these Board members to attend the meetings (food, lodging and travel). The motion carried unanimously.

7. Ron Cloyd suggested that our conferences be set at firm dates for each year, in order to provide for easier for planning. It was motioned by Jim Corbin and seconded by Gary Holzbauer that the conferences be held in the first week of November and the second week in April. Motion carried unanimously.

8. John Rebenstorff motioned that the spring conference be held in Reno again on April 6^th, 7^th and 8^th. It was seconded by Jim Corbin and carried unanimously

9. The new proposed A.I.I. Logo was presented by Scott Merritt. It was motioned by Bill Schwahn and seconded by Jim Corbin that the new logo be put before the membership for a vote. The motion carried unanimously.

10. Michael Leavitt requested that he be allowed to present a certification course at the next meeting for “Electrical Outlet Efficiency”.

This led to other discussion about different certification training which we could offer the membership, among them well testing and septic inspections. It was decided that all of these ideas be given to the Education Committee for review.

Adjourn: 10:02 PM

Sincerely, Rick DeBoard, secretary

BATHTUB SPOUT RESPONSES

Ken salvo posed the following question......... I will run across a bathtub every now and then that has no shower - only the tub. Yet, the fill spout has a diverter valve built into the spout anyway. Maybe it was the only fill spout the plumber had in his truck that day. Anyway, do you all write these up or what? I'm never quite sure what to do with these things - can something be harmed by having a diverter but no shower head above to divert water to? Ken Salvo - New Jersey

Is this type of spout a "Reportable Condition" or just one more item that goes unreported? Is there any risks associated with a diverter installed on a bathtub only???

Reggie Ayres responded..... No, if all connections are tight and leak proof inside the wall. Reggie Ayres - Medford, OR

I would note the condition. Since the diverter valve must extend to an outlet nozzle to a shower, it "should" follow that if no shower is installed then the outlet pipe has a plug. Certainly trying the diverter valve would produce an audible water noise in the wall if not plugged. That would be my direction. Have a good day! Jim Corbin - Bow, WA

Not usually an issue, as the connection for the water supply to the shower head is plugged off with a screw. If the plug was missing the leakage would have been very obvious the first time it was used. Just explain that the plumbing fixture behind the wall is probably set up for a shower line to be run if so desired. Chris Burkhart - Sandy, UT

I would take issue with that one Chris. I have never seen this misinstallation in situations that were designed for a shower. They are bathtubs with tub surrounds and not shower surrounds. I agree with you about the leak evidence occurring on the first and subsequent uses, but the real question is whether or not there could be anything to create a callback because we didn't say anything about the misapplication. We all hate callbacks, don't we Chris?

It only becomes a concern if the diverter section of the valve to the shower head has not been capped. In that case you would have a major leak when in the "shower" position. Tell your client that the tub/shower valve has the option to add a shower head in the future if they so desire. Jim Lucas - Camino, CA

Jim, those are good comment, but are we to assume that every tub control valve has the easy option of adding a shower head stem? The valve system is often in a 1950 or 1960 home. Wouldn't they need to upgrade the entire valve system to make the upgrade? I think that we would be in error to make your your comment. With any old fixture your client will either have a no shower option model or a seized riser plug. Once again, who wants to deal with the call back?

I haven't run across this one yet, but I don't think it is a reportable condition. The water flow to the tub would probably just stop if you pulled up on the diverter lever. With no pipe to the shower head attached, there would be no place for the water to go. If the outflow from the diverter wasn't capped off, you would surely be able to hear water gushing into the wall. Gary Holzbauer
- Junction City, OR

Well I would write it up to cover myself. This is what I see will happen. If it's a clamp on style you will fine a allen wench hole under the spout next to the wall. If this style It could shoot off the end of the pipe and hit a kid or someone in the tub at the time. If the screw on type it would not come off but there is always a chance that some thing bad could happen. Maybe a leak will start in the wall from it as well. I would just report it and cover myself in the report about it. Alan Muenzel - Sandy, UT

Larry Hoytt from northern California warned..... Ken: I would be careful with these. I always pull/twist the diverter valve to see what happens. A couple different times I found the same thing you did, only a tub, and when I pulled the diverter, water was shot into the stud bay within the wall. Most diverters just stop the flow and cause water to back up through the shower riser and out the shower head; however, there are also those that have an opening on their top or back sides that actually direct water to where a riser was intended. Larry Hoytt - CA

Here was my response to Ken...... Ken: My report documents in each bathroom the type of fixture or fixtures contained therein. When I have clearly reported that it is a tub only I rarely discuss the tub spout with the diverter within the report. I mention it on the walkthrough, but I see no harm in having it there. I do see how a leak is possible if the diverter is on and the pressure builds up in behind. That leak would occur where the spout and nipple connection is made and I suppose that there is the possibility of water shooting back within the wall. It would have to be a real brain dead client that did this very often. Just my thoughts. Michael Leavitt Orem, Utah

So as you see, my feelings were pretty much in harmony with the other people who responded to Ken's plight. Then came Garet Denise's response...

I pulled on one of these to make sure that it didn't shoot in the wall like Larry Hoytt warned. I figured better to find out now rather than a child do it later (it was a 1-year warranty inspection, and I did it with the owner's consent). The sucker locked up and wouldn't release. I tried shutting off the main and relieving pressure. Still no dice. Owner said he would call a plumber. I don't know how it was resolved. Garet Denise - CO

This has changed my thoughts and I have added a comment to my report. "The tub spout for this bathtub is the wrong model for this installation. This tub spout has a diverter that is designed for a built in shower head. Consideration should be given to changing is back to a bathtub only type of spout." I recommend that you add this comment to your reporting system to prevent those annoying customer callbacks. Michael Leavitt - Orem, Utah

PHOTO CHALLENGE #82 FEEDBACK

THE GREEN LIGHT BREAKER TYPE THINGIES

I have never seen such a thing. When all else fails, read the label. If the light is out then recommend it be replaced. Jon Gudnason - Placerville, CA

The green light tells you if you have power or not. If it is tripped you reset it and if the light does not come back on then replace it like it says. Chris Burkhart - Sandy, UT

I'd call an electrician, or stop at the building supply store on the way home and find out what the thing is. Gary Holzbauer - Oregon

Once again the MMM has a way of opening our eyes to a much broader world out there. We tend to get caught up in our own little inspection areas and then we get blindsided with a new inspection item. That is how this phot came about.

About a month ago I received a call during the middle of the day from Greg Justice in Oregon. Greg said..... "Hey Michael, I am looking at an electrical panel on a new home and i don't know what I am looking at. Firstly, I see the new AFCI breakers that you shared with us in the MMM a while back. But then there are these two circuit breaker looking things that have not throw handles. Instead, they have green lights on them. What are they?"

These types of calls and e-mails are great because I get to learn from others experiences too. Well I hadn't seen them before either, but I did a quick internet search with Leviton while Greg continued inspecting. He said that the electrician was going to be there shortly to correct the faulty AFCI breakers that he identified. I recommended that he be a brain sucker and extract everything that the electrician knew about the AFCI's and the breaker thingies with the green lights.

I quickly found out what they were and called Greg. He then sucked the electricians cerebrum dry (which didn't take long) and the electrician confirmed what the green light thingies are. I let the other MMM responders share their thoughts.........

I believe they are surge protection breakers. I have seen a different brand with red lights. Jim Archer - Florence, Oregon

I believe the units are surge protectors which need to be replaced when a surge is encountered. When the green lights are out the units no longer protect the system from equipment damaging surges at which time the units need to be replaced. After making sure that they are indeed surge protectors I would report the following :

Observed electrical system surge protectors at a subpanel. The units were not tested but the green lights were illuminated at the time of the inspection. This indicates that the protectors were operational. Monitor the units regularly to insure surge protection. (I would probably state that no attempt was made at determining the circuit(s) that were protected by the device.) Peter Barten - Bay City, OR

Great observations! Keep the great responses coming in. And of course keep the bizarre inspection conditions coming as well.

MOLD REPORTING?

Toxic molds seem to be a subject most agents or sellers would rather not know about. A client with mold sensitivities tested the mold near the shower of her potential new home and Stachybotris was confirmed. The home later sold to a family with young children. No remedial work was performed that I know of before or after the sale. What is the opinion of the forum on our responsibility as a home inspector in such a case. In our area the agents do share information and I hesitate to invite the kiss of death. Will Etherington Medford - OR

That is a good ethical question Will. How do we walk the line of mold reporting without crossing over the line? Some Inspectors are also set up to test for mold. Most, however, disclaim the responsibility of reporting on environmental issues and mold. Are those of you that disclaim the responsibility of mold, do you refrain from using the word mold in your report? Do you use the phrase "There appears to be a mold type substance...." or do you just not say anything at all about mold when you see it? The latter option is not advised at all...... Just because we aren't responsible to report environmental does not remove the responsibility to report mold if we stumble into it....... Does it?

PHOTO CHALLENGE #83

QUOTABLE QUOTE: "Get the snow shovels ready because there will be 6-9" more snow on the valley floors by this time tomorrow." Channel 5 Weather Report

HAVE A GREAT WEEK! Michael Leavitt & Co Inspections, Inc.

The Most Qualified Inspector in Northern Utah!

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Copyright; 2001 * Michael Leavitt & Co * 1145 N. Main St. * Orem, UT 84057 * 801-225-8020

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Imagine evaluating this toilet..... What do you report? Do any of you have a website that gives a detailed explanation of the origin and use of what this homeowner is trying to attempt?